Back in my senior year of high school (in the olden days of the early 90s), I had a class that was, roughly, a background in philosophy and debate. A handful of us very wise 17 and 18-year-olds got together and debated ideas presented before us. Looking back, it was a pretty careful history of philosophy they got us involved in, but at the time I just enjoyed arguing with my peers. However, every single debate came down to what we started calling “my truth” versus “capital-T truth”. I found this annoying, because every single argument essentially devolved into the same one, given time, and I and one or two other people were always on the side of Truth while all the others were on the side of personal “truth”. There was an extended metaphor about a child touching a hot stove and that being their basis for the understanding of truth, but I don’t remember it–but we got to the point where someone would say “hot stove!” and we’d all groan and change the subject.
Come to think of it, I was always the “Truth” side and there was one guy who was the “truth” side, and mostly no one else would say anything, absorbed as they were in their typical high-schoolish apathy. (A very stylish thing, in the days of grunge.) I think our perpetual argument mostly just irritated the others.
At the time, I thought that the notion of denying that there is any objective reality apart from our perceptions of it was nonsense. Of COURSE there’s something greater than human understanding of what we’re experiencing; else, how could we be experiencing it? However, I’d been raised in a conservative Christian subculture where the idea of objective truth was something you didn’t question.
A year or two later, in my little Christian college, I was introduced formally to the notion of postmodernism as a worldview, in a series of core curriculum classes. Of course I knew all the postmodern tenets–it would be hard to grow up in this society and not absorb them–but I’d never really had it laid out before me. And as I read and researched and absorbed knowledge since then, I’ve seen it in action. But what it essentially seems to boil down to is that silly argument: truth v. Truth.
The thing that’s so frustrating is that, when you get down to these political arguments, what you’re often running up against is that “Truth” people and “truth” people (I’d call them “Truthers” but that’s something else entirely…) aren’t operating in the same universe. Reality is… well… real to a person who believes in objective reality, whereas reality is perception to someone who believes that everything is subjective.
Our society has really gone the way to being a postmodern society that believes in reality as perception only, and that the only truth that counts is the truth that each person experiences. And thus appeals to reason or critical thought can’t be made–how can you think critically without any foundation in reality, without any basis for criticism or comparisons? And those of us who grew up with Truth as an unquestioned reality look around us in befuddlement as everyone seems to deny even the nose on their face… and it doesn’t matter what the facts are, because facts are just another subjective “truth”.
Well, I’m not sure where I’m going with this, but it’s something that I’ve been thinking about lately, as the whole Ahmadinejad-at-Columbia drama played out. Do you think we’ll ever return to a belief in objective reality? Can we survive as a society if we believe in nothing real? I don’t know the answers to these questions.



Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 10:48 |
Captn
(sitting on my philosophy degree – as a booster seat)…. That’s about all it is good for
You cover a wide base with this… I have found that truth & Truth are individual paths points of view… that the only universal is change. The moment that I insist that my Truth or truth is the penultimate is the moment I change from dreamer to tyrannt.
I have always found that a tyrannts underwear is a little tight on me
Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 11:44 |
As a former linebacker and rugby player I have found that tight underwear can be a very good thing in certain circumstances. Timm says he has found that “truth & Truth are individual paths points of view.” The fallacy in that statement is that he is treating the concept of Truth as if it were merely another “truth”. (My “truth” vs your “truth”) This is exactly the point that Cpt KJ is making — a significant presupposition within a large segment of western culture today is that the only “truth” that matters is one’s own subjective judgment at a given point in time, and even that may change based on how one’s feelings change. When one holds to an objective, absolute Truth as a basic presupposition there is no basis for discussion with one who does not — both end up talking past each other.
In the end it comes down to a binary choice: either there is one Truth or there is not. In his Pensees, Pascal addresses this choice with what has come to be known as “Pascal’s Wager.” Briefly, he says that either God (Truth) exists or he does not exist. If one acts as though Truth (God) is real and then dies to find out that there is no God, he has lost nothing. But . . . if one acts as though Truth (God) does not exist and then dies to find out that he was wrong, he has lost everything.
One final thought: I have never, in a 30 year Air Force career, been in a situation in which the statement “that may be true for you, but not for me” was either acceptable or appropriate.
Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 12:45 |
Viking… With a smile,
My Truth doesn’t try to dominate… it merely dancing this life alive… I have been in a situtaion where what maybe true for you is not true for me… I call that Church… I am free not to believe as others… just as you are free to believe as you wish….
My truth is in the mere ringing of the bells, in the joy of living… and not in the need to have other believe as I do…
I do have a vision, a dream, With apologies to Babylon 5 5th season episode 2
Unity’s Law
We are many individuals seeking to speak with one voice, the human one. We come from many beliefs, Agnostics, Animist, Christian, Hebrew, Hindu, Humanist, Islamist, Taoist, Zoroastrian and on… but we hear the same small ‘placid water’ voice.
It speaks in the language of trust and love, it is the language of the soul and heart. But it is always the same voice, it is the of the grandparents whispering to us, it is the voice of the grandchildren waiting for us to speak,
It is the small ‘placid water’ voice that now says “We are One! No matter the color, no matter the profession, no matter the possessions. We are One! No matter the ancestry, no matter the book, no matter the vision, We Are One! No matter this physical strength, no matter the hatred, no matter the fear. We are One!”
It says, “Gather together with a common cause, and agree to recognize this singular truth, and this singular law. We Must Be Kind to One Another. Each voice gained ennobles and enables us. Each voice lost diminishes us. We are light of the past. We are the voice of humanity. We are the only path to the future, for ‘We are One!’”
Yah I am a Secular Humanist
I am also a moral human being… I don’t need others to define my morality for me either… But I do need help with the hopscotch rules…
Pax um pax
Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 14:51 |
Sounds like a case of:”I have Truth and you have truth”. Both the Capt and Viking talk about a Universal Truth but give no indication what the criteria for such truth is.
Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 15:08 |
And here I thought all I ever did was chase my own criteria… not biting the bait have a good day folks
Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 20:09 |
The minute you create a criteria for “Capital-T Truth” you essentially defang it–you admit that Truth is, indeed, subjective. Therefore I won’t be suckered into treating it like my own personal variant of subjective reality. Nice try, though…
Wednesday, 3 October 2007 at 21:53 |
Quite the contrary. When you refuse to give the reasons why some truths are absolute and self evident then you defang it. When you say something is True simply because you say it is then I am go to bed confident that is your perception of a truth and not something absolutely true. When you can give me the reasons that your truth is absolute then I may stay awake awhile mulling the thing over.
To be honest the reason I asked for some sort of criteria was not to “sucker” you into anything but to understand what the heck you were writing about. Your post begs clarification and that was all I was looking for. Maybe you could post the e-mail address of the guy you used to argue with. Perhaps he can enlighten me.
Thursday, 4 October 2007 at 15:13 |
The concept of “Truth” as it is being discussed here is simply a short hand way of identifying the existence of moral absolutes against those who would deny them. Since Truth (i.e. moral absolutes) exists independent of human preference — that is, it comes from outside humanity, it does not spring up from within — it is not subject to any modification based on one’s preference or feelings.
The real argument, of course, is not about “Truth” vs “truth” per se, but about whether there is an entity outside of humanity that has structured and imposed a moral regime that is normative for everyone everywhere — i.e., does God exist? Kant and Nietzsche, among others, concluded that there is no God, and they followed the logic of their conclusion to the concept of the Ubermensch (Nietzsche) — whose existence is governed by the will to power — and to nihilism. Anyone at all familiar with the events of the 20th century can see just how successful that line of thought has been.
Thursday, 4 October 2007 at 16:16 |
I started writing a new comment but I think it’s going to be a new post. Stay tuned…
Thursday, 4 October 2007 at 16:16 |
I am pretty sure the argument is Truth vs truth.
Thursday, 4 October 2007 at 16:59 |
[...] of Truth… This is a continuation of the discussion from my previous post “truth v. Truth“, because the comment that I started writing there got too [...]